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Parent Post: Intellectual was a degrading term back in the day
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In Reply To
braven
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5/28/2025, 4:51:23 PM
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Hey Seraphima, Thank you for making this point with me. I have tried to point this out a few times, but others tend not to see it...such is life. All good though... language is a tough master. We could start a grammar Pocha. English Grammar is one of my favorite hobbies....pattern acquisition. Something like that. *Obfuscation of language.*...seems deliberate....no? Like some wickedly intelligent 'academic' decided the rest should follow 'their' rules. wtf is up with that? Seriously. The largest group of verbs/verbal patterns in the English Language are practically cliches. Not easy to accept that....as cliche's have no meaning apart from context. One I have noticed....like a red flag...*at the end of the day.* Listen to most any influencer on the internet, and at some point they will use that phrase. *Parrot alert*....something like that. There is one very specific group called Phrasal Verbs...verb plus particle ie look up, look out, run over, run around....etc And they have literally no meaning apart from context. Most every 1st language user, uses Phrasal Verbs every single time they speak, and yet have no idea that they are doing that. None. And 2nd language learners are like...wtf did you just say...or mean? So, one thing we need to agree on, as a people looking for a better future, is the best way to communicate with each other. Accurately would be good. Peace.
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seraphima
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5/30/2025, 12:04:28 AM
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Wow. I’ve been thinking over what you said for the last day. You make a very good point about phrasal verbs indeed—I use them all the time! I used to teach ESL and didn’t teach grammar for that reason. As someone who’s tried to understand English as “three languages in a trench coat,” I’m befuddled by its complexity myself and am often at a loss grammatically. When in graduate school, studying grammar with focus for the first time in my life, it dawned on me how amazing it is that anyone can learn this language at all. When teaching English, I often just tell my students the rules (and I focus on sentence clarity-modifiers, active and passive voice, redundancy, wordiness, etc. and I have a penchant for punctuation often spending a good deal of time on comms and the difference between a comma and a semi-colon). I tell them that even I can’t defend the rule and that most of the time, it’s just because it is. We were given a set of rules and by now, I can’t justify them. What I mean to say is, since you know more than me, I’d love to learn and start a pocha with you! You’re so kind to even suggest it. I’m more in love with the idea of sophistry and propaganda. Because English is so convoluted and native speakers and writers often have no idea what they’re doing, there’s room for a lot of…problems. Intentional problems. I like to study those problems and why people don’t think they’re problems—if that makes sense. Anyway, you’ve got intriguing ideas as always. 🙏💜
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braven
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5/31/2025, 4:58:13 PM
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Hey Seraphima, Again, you post was an inspirational read. Thank you for that. If you don't mind me asking, where did you teach ESL and for how long? It is really no surprise to me that you were an ESL teacher...your attention to detail and reflective insights are exceptional. Your enthusiasm is infectious and I would be honored to to share a Pocha with you. I may not be the best Moderator....not sure about the title and the job itself....lol Moderation in all things....especially moderation. Something like that.😅 I find we miss the point others are trying to make, and often intentionally. And to that point, what you wrote here rings true. "*Because English is so convoluted and native speakers and writers often have no idea what they're doing, there's room for a lot of...problems. Intentional problems.*" I have made this point several times, but each time only ended in angst and not debate. The art of debate seems lost, yet the art of *troll* is strong and everywhere these days. Perhaps, with a Grammar Pocha, we could set a pattern of accuracy in language leading to better communication...and that would be good. Again, it would be great to be a part of this, so count me in...all good. Peace.
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braven
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5/30/2025, 5:24:40 PM
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This is a really wonderful post. Thank you for sharing this...truly exceptional.🥰 Give me a day or so to respond. Peace.
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