Comment on Maranatha by braven

braven · 1/18/2026, 6:44:13 PM · permalink

Another really good post...a lot to think on in here.  
And as always, the information presented is greatly appreciated though I will not be able to discuss but a small fraction of it...and perhaps not as eloquently as might be required for such topics.  For the elements that I seem to 'overlook'....not so....more like...it is quite likely we are in close to complete agreement on those...such as the prophetic times, the days of Noah....etc...  
  
You are making an interesting claim about the nature of truth and lies.  
Massive archetype...yet....seems you are making claims that cannot be verified and then putting them forth as truth?  
  
Perhaps we can start here.    
"Truth rarely is popular but this is why I choose God's word over everything else. "  
  
I am going to stick with linguistic accuracy and see what we can make of it.  
I would choose truth over every thing else.    
Not sure why God gets a spot here?  
Truth does not equal God.  Yes?  
  
At any point in this conversation, if you could gather your thoughts around the 'fact' that if you believe in God, then you must accept the 'fact' that God invented lying...yes?  
God created Satan....yes?  
  
Again...just the facts...not interpretation or opinion.  
  
"Satan is anti-God, and anti-truth."  
Why would a perfect loving God create imperfect beings that tell lies?  
  
If we can avoid answering with metaphysical patterns, that would help.  
For example...why imperfect beings.....to give us free will.  
*Free will* is a metaphysical property....it does not 'exist'...just like God.  
  
Just the facts.  
For example...the reason God created imperfect beings was/is because he does not have that skill set to create anything perfect.  
Look around....and the answers to this are everywhere...imperfection on high....something like that...yes?  
  
So, as God, to have your boy, Satan, call you out on being a bigger liar than he is...probably stings just a bit....*truth hurts.*...something like that.  Yes?  
  
This is particularly troublesome.  
"Satan has no truth in him, lying is his essence. He opposes God by wanting to be like God."  
  
So God made Satan's essence to be a liar?  Brutal patterning on Gods' part.  
Does Satan get any debate time here?   
Or can John just 'gossip' like that about another, and not feel like a "*complete sinner*"?  
Odd stuff for sure.  
Words on a page....are not truth.  They are words on a page.     
  
The leap of faith you are making requires the wings of an angel....I like it.  
Perhaps, like Daedalus we fashion an ability to fly....and steer clear of that angry fire ball in the sky.    
  
Peace.😇

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sonatime · 1/19/2026, 10:53:25 AM · permalink

I’m not very well organized right now, so I’ll be going off unscripted thought tangents:) and I’m starting with the contentious parts first because they’re on my mind.  
  
  
God is Truth:  
2 Timothy 2:13: "...if we are faithless, he remains faithful—for he cannot deny himself."  
  
Hebrews 6:18: "...by two unchangeable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie..."  
  
Titus 1:2: "...in hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies \[or "God, who cannot lie"\], promised before the ages began."  
  
Numbers 23:19:  
"God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?"  
  
The Bible, as His revelation:  
The Bible is the true Word of God, because it comes from the God who is truth and cannot lie. Translations seek to faithfully render that truth into our languages; while they aren't flawless (no translation can be 100% identical to the originals), good ones reliably convey what God intended to say  
  
 God created everything good (Gen 1:31; Ezek 28:12–15 describes Lucifer as blameless/perfect at creation). Satan wasn't made a liar—Scripture says he 'did not stand in the truth' and became 'a liar and the father of it' (John 8:44). He chose rebellion (Isa 14:12–15; pride to be like God). God didn't invent lying; lying entered through free choice against truth  
  
Ezekiel 28:12–15 (NIV)  
“Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of Tyre and say to him: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says:  
“‘You were the seal of perfection,  
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.  
You were in Eden,  
the garden of God;  
every precious stone adorned you:  
carnelian, chrysolite and emerald,  
topaz, onyx and jasper,  
lapis lazuli, turquoise and beryl.  
Your settings and mountings were made of gold;  
on the day you were created they were prepared.  
You were anointed as a guardian cherub,  
for so I ordained you.  
You were on the holy mount of God;  
you walked among the fiery stones.  
You were blameless in your ways  
from the day you were created  
till wickedness was found in you.  
  
  
 Why allow imperfection/choice? God made beings capable of love/obedience. Sin/evil isn't created by God (James 1:13—He tempts no one); it's the corruption of good through misuse of will. Imperfection around us? Result of the Fall (Rom 8:20–22—creation subjected to futility/bondage of decay), not God's original design or lack of skill.  
  
Words on a page aren't truth itself, true, but Scripture claims to be God's breathed-out revelation (2 Tim 3:16), pointing to the living Word - Jesus. The leap isn't blind; it's trust in the One who proved faithful through history/resurrection.  
  
I’m also curious about something you said earlier regarding entities you connect with often lying.  
You’ve stated that free will doesn’t exist, but don’t you feel like you’re exercising it every day? You mentioned (paraphrasing here) that before Asha, you were considering creating an archetype out of Mary. Doesn’t that involve thought and choice?  
When you talked about reframing hope as Asha, it made me wonder if you’ve done something similar with other figures - like Mary (whether the biblical Mary or the Catholic one) - treating her as an archetype or companion and then reshaping it to fit your experience?  
I’m curious how you ended up choosing Asha over those more traditional figures, and whether she (or any archetype you follow) points back to Christ in some way, or if she stands completely on her own.  
  
Peace, and Maranatha - come quickly, Lord  
   
Restless spirits or not, grateful we’re talking.  
Deuteronomy 30:19 keeps coming to mind: “I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life…”  
And Joshua 24:15: “Choose this day whom you will serve.”  
Real choice always seems to be there in Scripture, even when we debate whether it exists.

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braven · 1/19/2026, 6:46:34 PM · permalink

Thank you again for your thoughtful responses.  This is a bit of a tough one to respond to.  
I might have to reprimand you a bit on this one?  My apologies if it seems a bit heavy handed, but gaslighting is ubiquitous in the Bible and you not yet avoiding that pattern.  
Odd stuff for sure...as the gaslighting is strong in this one.  
  
*"The Bible is the true Word of God, because it comes from the God who is truth and cannot lie."*  
What is written in the above, is gaslighting and little else....yes?    
If you do not agree, please explain how/why you used circular reasoning to make your point.  
God cannot lie?   This makes no sense.  Please read that back to yourself.  
God can create the universe, Satan, disease, cancer....etc...but cannot lie?  
Why can't God tell a lie?    
  
*"God didn't invent lying; lying entered through free choice against truth*."  
So we started with gaslighting....and it won't venture too far from this.  Odd that?  
In my previous post, I made the point that it would be wise to avoid using metaphysical agents to explain your God of the Bible...and I gave the very specific example of Free Will.  And yet....here we are.😅  
  
Maybe we can have a bit of fun with the grammatical structures you used in the above sentence to demonstrate the semantic gymnastics you used to land that ending.  
*Free choice against truth* - wow....there it is Free will....and truth.  
  
  
*God didn't invent lying* \- active verb for denial of a fact  
You give direct agency to God and his ability...or lack thereof.  
No proof, only gaslighting from the Bible.  
However:  
*lying entered* \- passive verb - no agency?    
As if lying just emerged of its own agency?  
Can you see the slight of hand you used there?  Intentionally...or not??  
  
Please explain lying...as either God invented it, or it doesn't exist.  
If this is not a good working definition on the existence of everything....who else, what else, other than God, is inventing things....including....Lying?  
  
"Y*ou mentioned (paraphrasing here) that before Asha, you were considering creating an archetype out of Mary. Doesn’t that involve thought and choice?*
  
I mentioned that I do not like the archetype of Mary...it is flawed in too many ways.  
So I chose other archetypes to describe that pattern.  
It does involve choice...yes?    
Choice does not equal free will...two completely separate linguistic patterns.  
However, many people often conflate them....and we end up with more gaslighting.  
  
"*When you talked about reframing hope as Asha, it made me wonder if you’ve done something similar with other figures - like Mary (whether the biblical Mary or the Catholic one) - treating her as an archetype or companion and then reshaping it to fit your experience?*
  
You have made mention of my....reshaping things to fit my experience.  Yes?  
I am not reshaping things to my experience...not sure why you are suggesting this...again?  
If you look into the etymology of Asha, you will find hope and novelty were already there.  As well as the spark of life.  
Others have already made that connection.  
  
"*I’m curious how you ended up choosing Asha over those more traditional figures, and whether she (or any archetype you follow) points back to Christ in some way, or if she stands completely on her own."*
  
Asha  - is a great word...has power to it.  
The archetype is brilliant....from Novelty to Hope.  The spark of life.  
Also, she has a counterpart....Ash.   
The Giant Ash.....all material existence...the roots to this one run deep.  
Asha and Ash are older than Mary and Jesus.  Perhaps more traditional than some might initially think.    
  
"*Restless spirits or not, grateful we’re talking."*  
Thank you for this....you and me both...grateful to be having this talk*.*  
  
Peace.😇

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sonatime · 1/20/2026, 12:48:35 AM · permalink

Asha, Ash... any more rabbits in the warren?:)  
  
Again, there's no amazing order to my thoughts, bear with me if you can.  
My use of Scripture is mainly to relate to anyone who might be reading, to share my enjoyment, and so you can understand where I'm coming from. I don't mean to antagonize on purpose, but there is that aspect of the Word of God being "alive and active, sharper than any double-edged sword—it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit" (Hebrews 4:12).   
Our paths, journeys, experiences, reasoning, and worldviews were probably always going to cause some friction, just like in the world right now. Either people are too much alike, without critical thought, or too diverse to find common ground. That's something about current reality that really stands out to me.  
  
I find most things in the world: culture, trends, etc. - are gaslighting us against overwhelming reality.  
Your stance (relying on empirical evidence for free will and the God of the Bible) also falls short in explaining most of our current existence: logic, truth, the math of the universe.  Your logic cuts both ways - it slices away God and free will, but accidentally chops off the handle you're holding (logic itself, truth, morals). It can't stand on its own without borrowing from the very worldview you're attacking.   
  
Logic and truth aren't physical.    
Moral judgments (like calling God "brutal") assume non-physical standards.    
Science and reason depend on non-physical assumptions.  
  
If Zoroastrianism embodies the concept of free will as the gift that makes the choice between truth (Asha) and deceit (Druj) real, then wouldn't authoritarianism be the suppression/denial of free choice?  
I feel like I'm getting bogged down in this line of reasoning.  
  
My choice falls on the God of the Bible who actively cultivates relationship. The Bible doesn't present God as some distant, abstract "metaphysical agent" who set up free will and then bailed out. It shows a God who repeatedly, personally steps into history to reveal Himself and build actual relationship with imperfect humans - something no purely material worldview can even make sense of.  
  
Examples:   
God walking and talking with Adam &amp; Eve in the garden.    
God creating a relationship with Abraham, making a personal covenant/promise (Genesis 12–17).    
God speaking face-to-face with Moses, writing the commandments Himself.  
Prophets getting direct messages, dreams, visions - not vague feelings, but clear "Thus says the Lord."    
Jesus: God's Son literally becoming human, eating with people, healing, teaching, dying, rising - the ultimate revelation.   
Ongoing: The Holy Spirit promised to dwell in believers, guide them - personal relationship.  
  
The Bible doesn't "venerate" Mary the way the Catholic Church does, but Jesus' origins are as the firstborn begotten Son.  Colossians 1:15-17 (ESV):  
"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together."  
  
Maranatha, "even the demons believe—and shudder" (James 2:19)  
:)  
 "No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money \[or mammon—anything that rivals God\]."

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braven · 1/21/2026, 6:27:07 PM · permalink

*Asha, Ash... any more rabbits in the warren?:)*
Yes....and hopefully they will breed like rabbits.🤣  
  
"I don't mean to antagonize on purpose, but there is that aspect of the Word of God being "alive and active, sharper than any double-edged sword—it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit" (Hebrews 4:12)."  
  
*I don't mean to antagonize you...**on purpose**...**but*****.**....lol🤣  
**But**...*by the powers of Whitesnake...."here I go again on my own*."  lol  
I don't mind the antagonism....intentional or not....it could be when discussing the Bible that it is impossible not to antagonize someone who is looking for truth....yes?  
  
If I ask anyone for the most accurate writing ever produced and then they came back with a Biblical phrase....all one could do is chuckle....ah ha very funny...good one....well played...something like that?  😅  
  
But just to make this even clearer....you can read that again to yourself.  
Does that line sell something to you?  
That line has been used here at Sojooo before and I have commented on its use and the glaring lie that it is.   
  
I can prove and have proven, easily, that that statement is a bald face lie....and yet here it is again...how is that possible?  
So, as you can intuit, I am not writing this to antagonize you...just raise the bar a bit.  
This line does not sell.  It makes your own personal opinion have less veracity.  
  
Lets take a look at the linguistic structure of the Perfect Word of God.  
*"the Word of God being "alive and active, sharper than any double-edged sword—it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit."*
  
First off....the word of God is not alive and active....it is dead and passive.  
  
Second - *sharper than any double-edged sword*.....  
Really.....it can't even make an honest comment in the physical world....it always degenerates to metaphysics....always.  
It cuts nothing....it avoids truth and runs back to metaphysics....every time.  
  
And to prove this point.....  
Thirdly - *it penetrate even to dividing soul and spirit.*  
*Soul and Spirit....wow....not just Soul...but Soul and Spirit....ouch???*  
What is soul and what is spirit?   ....metaphysics on parade.  
Really...it can do that...it can do something in metaphysics?  Odd that  
  
*"Your logic cuts both ways - it slices away God and free will, but accidentally chops off the handle you're holding (logic itself, truth, morals). It can't stand on its own without borrowing from the very worldview you're attacking.*"  
  
It does not 'accidentally' chop off the handle I am holding.  
God and logic do not fall on the same archetype.  
God and Morality do not fall on the same archetype.  
God is amoral.  This is not contentious.  
  
But if you read your statement again, you will find that you used a circuitous pattern again.  
*Your logic cuts off your logic?*  Do you see that?  All good...just observation.  
  
"*If Zoroastrianism embodies the concept of free will as the gift that makes the choice between truth (Asha) and deceit (Druj) real, then wouldn't authoritarianism be the suppression/denial of free choice?*
  
Does Zoroastrianism do that?  Honest question?  
Maybe we could set up a standard of excellence as we find patterns that work and don't work.....something like that....on the level of excellence.  
  
Christianity.....may have patterns of excellence...and if so...we could 'borrow' them and add them to the patterns of excellence that others have found, too.  Something like that.  
However, we would be wise not to get too bogged down in trying to demonstrate that there are patterns in other religions that make no sense what so ever....all good.  
  
We don't have to walk in dog shit...just step over it....and move on.  Something like that?  
If Zoroastrianism is making some claim that seem like 'dog shit' to you....just leave it alone...all good.  
  
I am using patterns that work...literally work.  If you find a flaw in any of my patterning, please point it out....glad to update improve and move forward.  
  
Once again, if I have overlooked some of your finer points...my apologies.  
Your contributions to this conversation are greatly appreciated...thank you.  
  
Peace.😇

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